Okay, here are kind of a bunch of worry wart newbie questions:
1. How often/long should kids nurse? What I'm really getting at is, how to tell if they aren't nursing enough (or does that even happen).
--Reason is, I got both kids to suckle within the first 1/2 hr to 45 of birth. They nurse on their own, but to me, it doesn't look like often or long enough. Her udder is HUGE and looks bigger every time I see her. I tested her when they were born and again this morning, milk comes out great from both teats.
I see Chico pooping yellow milk poops. Think I have not yet seen Isabelle poop at all. Her bum is clean, not pasty. Granted I am not there most of the time. I just pop in throughout the day and sit with them for 15 mins every now and then.
2. How much sleeping is normal? Day 1 they both slept most of the time. I thought they would be bouncing around. Day 2 (today) I put them outside and they were up most of the day, then passed out when I brought them in after like 6 hours. or 5. I forget.
3. Penny (mom) did not hardly seem to eat at all on pasture. She seemed to just worry over them and talk to them the whole time. Should I worry about that or she will just eat when she's hungry? She eats of the hayrack fine in the stall but they are sleeping right there. Maybe it was just new mom jitters, it was her first time out with them. (I had to rig them a new yard because the rooster was stalking the babies so I couldn't use the barnyard)
4. How long do they need to be on straw till they can be on shavings or pine pellets again. Straw is a royal pain in my tush! Our overnight lows are usually low sixties, sometimes high fifties.
Replies
Well today she looks pretty even, so apparently they discovered the other side.
Just to be sure I understand: if they start favoring a side I should milk the full side even before that first two weeks is up? I do intend to start milking her in the mornings around 2 weeks (putting the kids in the next stall)
Typically, if a doe is lopsided, you milk out the full side twice a day. When the kids are a couple weeks old, you might want to separate them overnight, milk her out when you separate them to make sure both sides are equally empty, so in the morning, you'll get a true picture of which side is producing more.
Deborah, she is already lopsided. What can I do about that? Do I milk out her other side?
This happened to her with her last kid, she had a singleton who only nursed one side and when we got her, she only had milk on the one side and her udder has never quite recovered. I believe these two are nursing what was her smaller side.
I think based on what Rachel was saying about how hard it can be to put weight on a nursing doe, plus she is not on great pasture right now, she is in a small pen with no browse to speak of, I will keep feeding her what I have been and when she gets back out on the good pasture maybe I'll see if she can cut it back a bit.
That's per day, but it's a general guideline. Usually the feed bag tells you what they suggest. Keep an eye on her udder to make sure the kids don't get a favorite side. You don't want the doe to wind up lopsided.
Juliana Goodwin said:
My husband says I worry to much about the goats too. But I just love them so much I just always want to do the right thing to have happy healthy goats.
So 1 pound for 3 pounds of milk, if she is making 1.5 lb for each kid she is nursing then 1 lb of grain would be right for her but is that per day or per feeding? I feed 2x.
Update: when I took them out this morning half of her udder was quite deflated and Isabelle had a rolly little belly, Chico not quite so much but I did feel some. So I suppose once more I am clucking over nothing which my husband always teases me for.
Isabelle was doing ninja moves off her mom's back this morning so no problems there :)
Rachel and Deborah thanks so much again.
I personally think they do look pretty scrawny. Especially compared to the grown up versions of NG with those round bellies... lol I try really hard to keep my goats at a healthy weight too, so I get where you're coming from on the feeding thing... I just know that when you have a milking/nursing doe, it's better to err on the side of feeding too much, because you'll be able to tell when they start to get fat. Rather than not feeding enough, and then creating a tax on your goat's system that is hard to correct once they start that cycle. (as in it's hard to put on weight on a doe that is nursing/milking)
If you're worried about the kids eating still, a good secondary "measure" is to keep an eye on their activity. If they don't run and play when they are up and about, you might have cause to worry, but if they are actively seeking mom for food, playing with each other, etc. then they are probably getting what they need when you aren't looking.
Rachel gave you excellent info, and I just wanted to add that kids nurse about every 15 minutes for maybe 30 seconds, so although they don't seem to nurse much, it really adds up. I was totally freaking out when I had my first kids because other species nurse for much longer sessions -- like humans and puppies and piglets and just about everything! Feeling a full belly is always good reassurance though.
Most printed stuff says 1 pound of grain for 3 pounds of milk, which is about 1/3 gallon, so a little more than a quart. I just assume that if they're making at least 1.5 pounds for every kid they're nursing.
I just arbitrarily used the cup scoop I used laster year when I was milking her. She was eating that much grain plus alfalfa pellets while milking (and truth be told, sometimes more if I could not milk her fast enough and she will NOT stand without grain). I never thought she looked overweight and I am very conscious of keeping my animals from being overweight.
And no I am not milking her now, so of course I have no idea how much milk she is putting out. Am hoping to start milking her again around 2 weeks, but that question will be aNOTHER threat lol.
I know I picked up Chico once and felt a full little belly, but a lot of the time I pick them up they don't feel "full" that I can tell. Do they always look scrawny at this age?
I'll answer you as best as I can... mind you, most of my answers are from asking Q and remembering the answers, or just an educated guess. I don't have any kids of my own yet. :)
If their bellies feel "full" most of the time, they are getting plenty of milk. If they are moving around and playing actively, they are also probably getting plenty of milk also. I know of a lot of kids that "snack" rather than eat huge "meals" all at once. If her udder is growing, and still supple (not getting hard or hot) then it's probably just growing to meet demand. If it's hard, or lumpy, she might be having issues with Mastitis.Yellow poop is normal, and some does will clean up after kids when they poop. I'd say, if there's no distension in the belly, your doeling is most likely just pooping when you aren't looking, or her mom is cleaning her up.
Sounds to me like they are sleeping a normal amount.
If your dam is eating hay fine, don't worry. :)
The reason for straw at delivery is because shavings can cling to wet babies, and they can breath them in when they stick to their faces, and before they have control over their little bodies. Now that they are dry and mobile, I'm pretty sure there's no reason not to go back to shavings if that's what you prefer, and especially since your temps are warm.
Grain (if I'm remembering right) should equal 1lb for every quart of milk you're getting... since you're letting your kids nurse, and it's early to be milking, I think 1/2 a cup is good... maybe even more, but I'm not 100% sure about that. Personally, with her nursing, I'd err on the over fed side than the underfed... you'll see if she's gaining weight and can adjust, but putting weight on a nursing/milking doe isn't easy from what I hear. Esp. not at first.
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