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Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres May 29, 2011 at 10:46pm

Jaci Jahn said:

Gosh it's very frusterating, I don't think we've done a thing right since bringing them home. I guess I try to find grass hay now.

Dont' feel bad, Jaci!! Wadding through the information on goats is mind boggling!! I know for myself, I just really didn't "GET" everything until I had applied a few things (incorrectly) and had real life situations to apply the "rules" to. Deb is an AMAZING resource. I doubt you'll find anyone that's read/understands all the information as well as she does, and lucky for all of us, she's willing to share!! Hang in there!

Deborah Niemann-Boehle May 29, 2011 at 10:00pm

Ivermectin pour-on wouldn't hurt them at this point, and it might help.

Jaci Jahn said:

This may be a dumb question but do you think I should put the Ivermectin pour on stuff on without doing a fecal?

We got it to use for the ear mites, but the research I did said that what they have is probably Psoroptic mange, like the stuff rabbits get, because it's centered mostly on the ears, but they do itch some places on their bodies. The Ivermectin says it treats Sarcoptic mange. So I haven't put it on them yet, was waiting for that Vet call, which won't come til probably Tuesday because of the holiday. So no fecal til Tuesday either.

It sounds like I need to fix this NOW, and not later. So any help is appreciated.

Jaci Jahn May 29, 2011 at 7:50pm

This may be a dumb question but do you think I should put the Ivermectin pour on stuff on without doing a fecal?

We got it to use for the ear mites, but the research I did said that what they have is probably Psoroptic mange, like the stuff rabbits get, because it's centered mostly on the ears, but they do itch some places on their bodies. The Ivermectin says it treats Sarcoptic mange. So I haven't put it on them yet, was waiting for that Vet call, which won't come til probably Tuesday because of the holiday. So no fecal til Tuesday either.

It sounds like I need to fix this NOW, and not later. So any help is appreciated.

Deborah Niemann-Boehle May 29, 2011 at 7:20pm

I've had more than 250 ND kids so far, and I have never had a 2 month old kid that weighed 10 pounds. Those goats are severely undernourished. A two to three week old kid weighs ten pounds, and at that point, I'm giving them four, six-ounce bottles a day. Some people might be giving three, eight-ounce bottles a day at that point, but I don't like to overfill them. Unless you're trying to force down 12 ounces at a time in a kid that size, the belly should not be grossly distended. If you're only giving 6-8 ounces at a time, and the belly looks distended, it sounds like maybe they don't have a lot of meat on their bones, which could also mean parasites.

Maybe you misunderstood the feeding directions from the woman who sold you the goats? You never said what the complete feeding routine has been, but anything that results in 10-pound goats at two months is not good.

You can order goat supplies online from Hoegger and other places.

Jaci Jahn said:

They are does. We were following the directions that the lady we got them from gave to us. She runs a dairy farm. They have been getting milk replacer, and I realize not everyone agrees with that, but what's done is done. So you really think we should start up with that again? Jasmine has been off for a few days. Her belly would swell up so big when we gave her milk, I thought it was bad for her (as well as following the advice we were given) We have been TRYING to get them to eat grain this whole time. Finally today they ate some out of my boyfriends hand. The vet was out here shortly after we got them and said they looked good at that time(end of April). But I kept telling Brandt I didn't think they were getting any bigger, and I finally made him hold them and weight them on the scale that way. We have been having an ear mite issue. They have been getting an herbal wormer, but I'm afraid coming from the dairy they may have come with some worms. We have left a message for our vet and maybe I should have him do a fecal if we can get him to look at the ears. I've just been scared to give them the ivermectin not knowing if it will really kill the ear mites, since the ivermectin is for a different type of mite. Hopefully the vet will get back to us SOON. We have already left a message before. I've been working 12 hour days lately and so I don't even get to see them everyday, I really on my boyfriend to tell me how they are doing on those days.

We have really slim pickings for goat supplies around here too. They don't really seem to like this mineral anymore either.

Thanks for all the help guys.

Jaci Jahn May 29, 2011 at 7:13pm

These are copied from emails I received from the lady.

Currently they get a little hay to pick out, but the milk is their main food. They are ready to start some grain, though it will be a while before they eat much. If you have no access to a source of fresh goat or cow milk, you’ll need to feed lamb or kid milk replacer, usually available at a Tractor Supply or Southern States or other feed store. Do not feed calf milk as it will bloat and kill goat babies. With the lambar bucket, they eat free choice (whenever they want to) but you can bottle feed them four feedings per day for a week, go to three feedings for three weeks, then two feedings until they are 7 weeks old. Then they go to one milk feeding daily for another week or so, and should be eating grain and hay well enough to stop all milk feeding. You’d need to keep hay, grain, and a bucket of clean water in front of them at all times to encourage them to eat.

Then Lambie had diarhea about 4 days after we brought them home and she wrote us this email.

The soft stool you describe is most likely from the change of scenery and the stress of adjusting to the milk replacer. If you got some replacer from the store already, mix it half as strong as the directions say. I can’t remember if I told you this last weekend, but we’ve found that the replacer is too strong for them at full strength and can actually cause scours. They’ve been used to eating free choice (meaning little slurps whenever they want to) so timed feedings of larger amounts will require an adjustment.

So they have been getting 1/2 strength milk replacer.

We've been starving our girls :( I am exremely saddened by this. How do I right this wrong I've done to them?

Jaci Jahn May 29, 2011 at 6:37pm

They are does. We were following the directions that the lady we got them from gave to us. She runs a dairy farm. They have been getting milk replacer, and I realize not everyone agrees with that, but what's done is done. So you really think we should start up with that again? Jasmine has been off for a few days. Her belly would swell up so big when we gave her milk, I thought it was bad for her (as well as following the advice we were given) We have been TRYING to get them to eat grain this whole time. Finally today they ate some out of my boyfriends hand. The vet was out here shortly after we got them and said they looked good at that time(end of April). But I kept telling Brandt I didn't think they were getting any bigger, and I finally made him hold them and weight them on the scale that way. We have been having an ear mite issue. They have been getting an herbal wormer, but I'm afraid coming from the dairy they may have come with some worms. We have left a message for our vet and maybe I should have him do a fecal if we can get him to look at the ears. I've just been scared to give them the ivermectin not knowing if it will really kill the ear mites, since the ivermectin is for a different type of mite. Hopefully the vet will get back to us SOON. We have already left a message before. I've been working 12 hour days lately and so I don't even get to see them everyday, I really on my boyfriend to tell me how they are doing on those days.

We have really slim pickings for goat supplies around here too. They don't really seem to like this mineral anymore either.

Thanks for all the help guys.

Deborah Niemann-Boehle May 29, 2011 at 6:16pm

They should weigh about twice that much at their age. If they're wethers, it's probably not a big deal, but if they're does, this could be problematic because they may never be big enough to breed safely. If you are not giving them milk, I'd start that up again. It's high in calories, protein, and calcium, and will be easy for them to digest. I've never really thought about how fast they gain, but they go from about 3 pounds at birth to 25 pounds at two months, so that's close to three pounds a week average. Did they ever have a bad case of worms or coccidia?

Jessica Furnish said:

My 2 babies are about two and half months and weigh about 13 pounds. How fast should they gain? They are both very petite.

Kare May 29, 2011 at 6:08pm

I had heard that 10-12 weeks was the best, but bucks could be weaned earlier. My doelings still have free choice from their dam and they are nearly 3 months old. The buck I weaned at 8 weeks old. He seems to be doing ok. When measured a couple of weeks ago (at 3 months old) he was 14 inches tall and he has a healthy rumen. I would guess he weighs 25 pounds, but haven't weighed him. He is bigger than the two doelings that are 2 weeks younger than him and they are still getting milk.

Jessica Furnish May 29, 2011 at 5:57pm

My 2 babies are about two and half months and weigh about 13 pounds. How fast should they gain? They are both very petite.

Janel Rickey May 29, 2011 at 5:19pm

I read that you aren't suppose to wean bottle fed babies until 3months. Our babies are 2 at 2 months and the other just under and we are giving grain all day, 20 ounces of whole milk, given 10 ounces 2 times a day and they free range during the day, and at night we give them hay, they have minerals at choice and also Baking soda. They are also drinking water... Millie weighs probably a good 25 to 30 lbs, Jasper is probably 20-25, and AnnaBelle is our smallest, but she is still probably 15-20 lbs (but her mother is a smaller goat). Besides having a wonderful breeder who has given me lots of information, I found these websites to be very helpful, http://fiascofarm.com/, http://www.laurelhaven.net/index.html, and just google for finding answers. We are brand new to this goat experience and these are our first babies. We have bumps in the road, but overall it has been a wonderful experience. I hope this information was somewhat helpful!!

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