Needing some advice about copper and minerals!

Hi all, this is my first time on this forum. (Hope I'm following all the rules...)

I have been reading a lot about feeding copper and mineral mixes to goats. A bit confused though. Is it one or the other? Or should I give both copper and minerals?

I didn't know what the signs of deficiency were till I started reading. A bit worried about my goats... My black yearling doe has lately been shaded reddish on her hips and back legs. The hair roots are dark though. Her coat is also a bit rough. My yearling buck has the 'fish tail' look a tiny bit, unless I'm being overparanoid. My others look normal. None of them are shedding anywhere I can see. All their gums and lower eyelids look dark rather than pale (heard that paleness could be a sign of health issues...is that correct?).

I put out a mineral block for them to have free choice in the pasture (kicking myself for not doing it before). It has copper listed on the ingredients, but doesn't say what kind. Should I also give them copper? Is that something they need regularly as a matter of course? Or should they only get it when they show signs of needing it?

Thanks for any and all advice!!

You can definitely over dose them. HOWEVER. If you use Copper Oxide Wire Particles (COWP) to give them the "extra" outside of their loose minerals, it's harder. The kind of copper in loose minerals is usually Copper SULFATE. It's digested and passed. The kind of Copper in COWP is OXIDE, and it's actually physically WIRE particles. They embed in the rumen, and then are slowly dissolved/absorbed into the system. It's pretty difficult to OD on copper with COWP and free choice. You'll need to know a bit about your land, and what nutrients your goats are getting before you'll know where the balance for your goats is. For example, Deborah, the owner of this site, feeds her goats MUCH more copper than I have to feed mine, because she has sulfur in her water. Sulfur binds to the copper in her goats, and keeps them from absorbing it the right way, so she has to compensate for that.

Replies

Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres October 23, 2013 at 5:43pm

yeah, you don't have to give it to them every day, just every three months or so.
Rachel Griebenow October 23, 2013 at 5:20pm

Ah. Simple simple.
Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres October 23, 2013 at 5:18pm

My goats don't get mixed feed either, but I still give copper every three months or so over whole oats and whole barley. (that's what I have for feeding my milking does)
Rachel Griebenow October 23, 2013 at 5:15pm

Well, that sounds straightforward enough... :)

What about if they are just on pasture and don't get a mixed feed? How would you administer it?
Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres October 22, 2013 at 10:10am

You can order it on line. Jeffers has a goat/sheep sized bolus now, but I have the cow size, and I break it open. I just sprinkle them onto their feed and they eat them just fine. Some people use other methods. :) There's a few threads here about it.
Rachel Griebenow October 22, 2013 at 10:07am

Aha. Where do you get your COWP from?
Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres October 21, 2013 at 10:13pm

Goats *do* have a higher need for copper in general.
Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres October 21, 2013 at 10:12pm

You can definitely over dose them. HOWEVER. If you use Copper Oxide Wire Particles (COWP) to give them the "extra" outside of their loose minerals, it's harder. The kind of copper in loose minerals is usually Copper SULFATE. It's digested and passed. The kind of Copper in COWP is OXIDE, and it's actually physically WIRE particles. They embed in the rumen, and then are slowly dissolved/absorbed into the system. It's pretty difficult to OD on copper with COWP and free choice. You'll need to know a bit about your land, and what nutrients your goats are getting before you'll know where the balance for your goats is. For example, Deborah, the owner of this site, feeds her goats MUCH more copper than I have to feed mine, because she has sulfur in her water. Sulfur binds to the copper in her goats, and keeps them from absorbing it the right way, so she has to compensate for that.
Rachel Griebenow October 21, 2013 at 9:45pm

So it sounds like goats almost need so much copper that it's kinda hard to actually overdose them on it? (Or something...that sounded stupid...not sure how to phrase it...) Just trying to figure it all out.
Rachel Whetzel at MigMog Acres October 21, 2013 at 3:27pm

PS

I don't know that you would notice them "acting desperate" if they needed more minerals and weren't getting them off the block... not sure, but I don't think that you would, necessarily.

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