My buck *still* has clumpy poop. He got COWP on 12 July, then a double whammy of Valbazen and morantel on 16 July. I also suspect that every Nigie except perhaps the baby buck is copper deficient. I thought their tails looked "fishy" and now that I have the Lamanchas I really notice that the Nigies are decidely "fishy" compared to them. I hope that last sentence makes sense! They have free access to Sweetlix meat maker minerals and baking soda. So-when can I re-worm the buck and how soon can I give him more COWP? I know I read that they can get it every 4-6 weeks to a max of 8g during worm season but if he is truly deficient could he get it sooner?
And one of the LM doelings has developed clumpy poop, probably from the stress of her new home. Her breeder wormed her with 5ml Valbazen on 7/21 (she's a a pretty big 4 month old). When do you think I could worm her again?
I so want to get onto a natural or herbal worming regimen but I feel like I need to get on top of everyone's initial issues first.
Thanks for any suggestions/advice. Sorry to be such a pest with all the questions but I am really stressing over making sure everyone is healthy
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Antibiotic resistance is a perfect analogy. And because there is not a lot of money in dewormers or antibiotics, the drug companies aren't doing the research to create new ones. They'd rather spend their research money on things that are dosed regularly (like cholesterol or diabetes drugs in humans).
Black is an easy color! I hadn't thought about that one. Most of my goats with copper deficiency were gold, so if you'd never seen them before, you would have just assumed they were cream.
I don't know that there is a "right" answer to your question. You CAN give some dewormers every day for three days or repeat after a week or any number of regimens. But if the worms are resistant to what you're using, it will all be for nothing. Seven years ago the first goat I lost to worms died a couple weeks after I gave him Safeguard for three days in a row. Turned out that the farm he came from was resistant to Safeguard, and the woman didn't tell me. This is why it's really important to get as much info as possible from the breeders about what has been used, how much, and how often. If she says she doesn't have a resistance problem, it could be that she just doesn't know it yet. Using Valbazen and Morantel only again would be a waste of time, since it didnt' work the first time. At the FAMACHA training, they suggested adding a dewormer from a third class, which would be either ivermectin, eprinex, or cydectin, and I've listed them in order from most likely to be resistant to least likely. But Cydectin is really considered the big guns, so they suggest that you don't use it until you really need it. If your breeder has not used ivermectin, it would be a good one to start with. And you would give all three dewormers at the same time -- Valbazen, morantel, and ivermectin.
I wouldn't give COWP any sooner than a month after giving it to him because research has shown that's safe. A few years ago, I had a buckling die a week after giving him COWP, and I had the liver checked for copper level. It was 175 ppm. Normal is 25-150, but they don't consider toxicity until 200+. My point is that it can raise the level a lot, and you don't want to overdose them. Having lived with copper issues for several years now, I don't get too hung up on a single symptom. After switching my bucks to MultiMin this spring, I saw serious fish tails in them for the first time ever. But I certainly was not about to give them more because I know someone who had goats die of copper and selenium toxicity after injecting it, so it's serious stuff. They look great in every other way, so I'm trying to ignore a couple of fish tails. Having just purchased them, you don't really know if their coats are faded, but that's another symptom. I know what color all of my adults are supposed to be, so if they start fading, I know why. The other big issues are fertility related -- does that don't cycle, abort, give birth prematurely, etc., and bucks with low sex drive, not getting does pregnant, etc.