Hello,

I have been hanging around this forum for many months and have learned so much from all of the questions on here and many knowledgeable answers.   And simply enjoyed my time reading thru it all.  So now I come to you all with a question about Nigerian Dwarf bucks.  I have bred and raised Pure bred Nubians and La Manchas for 13 years.  Used to be a member of ADGA and by the grace of God have never had a lot of problems or troubles in those years.  I ran a clean closed herd though and did not show.  And bought only CAE and CL negative animals.  So started out with great stock.  But truly we only ever had a few bad things pop up here or there but not many.  I, Praise God, have never had a case of Urinary Calci and I had to feed all my huge bucks at least two cups of All Grain twice a day to keep them in good condition.  And never any UC from that way of feeding.  I can count on my two hands the amount of times I have had a Coccidiosis out break in babies on my farm.  And most of the cases was in a single year that I experimented with pasteurizing the goat milk before feeding it to the kids that year.  So I didn't do that again.   I have learned so much all those years incrementally about goats and there care.  But Nigerians seem to be very different from the larger ones.   A few months ago I decided to sell off all my larger goats and move into the Nigerian Dwarfs for the many reasons you all have gotten into them.  They are more economical and easier to handle and my family just doesn't need the amount of milk two large milkers supply, every day, year round anymore.  So I have bought my new starter herd.  Four young doeling bottle babies.  And I have been advised and told time and again to raise these babies on ADM or Nobal goat.  Do they really get cocci that easy?  I cant even find ADM in my area.  Can I not just raise them on Purina Goat chow with out a problem?  After all that is what they will be eating as adults.  And all the people I bought from, feed their adult bucks Noble goat or ADM year round all the time or else they could get UC?  Do Nigerian bucks really get it that easily? And I really don't want any animal living on a medicated feed its whole life.  And can I really not feed grass hay to bucks unless I feed alfalfa as well?  I buy a huge delivery of wonderful Bermuda hay once a year for all our ponies and goats.  And that is what I always fed my other goats with out any troubles.  So I guess my most important question is...can I feed my bucks a small amount of Purina goat chow topped with ammonium chloride and topped with a small amount of Boss.   And Burmuda hay.  Or will that lead to trouble for them.  It is the best hay I can get at a good deal in bulk.   And I have had to feed my milkers alfalfa pellets for years because one can not get quality alfalfa hay in this area consistently.  We live on 10 acres and I have three good pens I rotate grazing with the bucks in.  With good grass in it so they would be and are getting that as well.  Right now I have only purchased one ND full grown buck and slowly moved him over onto the way I described above.   He is on the Purina with Boss and AC.  Just about a table spoon of grain and  table spoon of BOSS and sprinkle of the AC.  But I have two more young bucklings that are going to be delivered this month.  I don't want to make them sick at all.  Please advise me if anyone feeds Burmuda hay.  And feeds Purina goat chow to bucks.     Sorry this was so lengthy but  wanted you to have all the facts of what I want to be feeding them.  Thank you for your time.  

You need to be a member of Nigerian Dwarf Dairy Goats to add comments!

Join Nigerian Dwarf Dairy Goats

Email me when people reply –

Replies

  • We do copper about once every 4 months, or three times a year. We have high sulfur and iron in our well water, which binds with the copper, meaning that the goats have to consume a lot more copper than they otherwise would if we didn't have that problem with our well water. The coat is the first thing to show a problem when they're low on copper because copper is very important for hair pigmentation. So, a black goat starts to look red, a red goat looks cream, and cream goat can go completely white.

    I'm currently collecting data on copper use in goats, and with 400+ responses so far, loss of color in coat is definitely the most common symptom. The study will be closing at the end of this month, and then I'll be officially crunching the numbers, but I can tell you that the coat color is a good early indicator of deficiency.

  • Deborah: So, you copper bolus as a means of goat maintenance? I bolused my herd last spring due to some obvious condition issues, but didn't think to do it as a general maintenance on the goats. If you don't mind me asking, how often, and when, do you bolus your herd? Do you bolus does and bucks? At what age do you bolus your doelings/bucklings? Thanks as always!

  • When I started supplementing with copper, I only did the goats that I thought really needed it, and I had this one that I thought was perfectly fine because her fertility was great. She always had triplets, and she had the softest hair in the whole herd. Well, after I bolused some of the other goats, I realized her coat felt wiry compared to the ones that had been bolused two weeks earlier. I even asked my husband to compare the coats and tell me which one was softest (without telling him why I was asking), and he immediately indicated the goat that was bolused. So I started doing all my goats.

    I am not crazy about the Purina because I know they use GM corn (90% of the corn grown in the US is GM), but it's taken me years to get to where I am today with production and fertility and at this point, I'm really nervous about changing anything. We had six does on the Top Ten one-day milk test list in 2011, and I have one that is on track for being Top Ten on DHI this year -- which is amazing considering that five or six years ago, most of my goats were not even milking good enough to get milk stars. I've pretty much come to the conclusion that once you get the nutrition nailed, everything else falls into place.

  • Thank you so much for your reply Deborah.  It is very encouraging and has helped to put me more at ease as to how I feel I should be feeding grown bucks and babies as well.  I knew from reading all your threads that you did indeed feed Purina Goat chow but I could not find where you ever said that is what you did feed your adults or growing bucks when you fed them.  So was so unsure of what I felt I wanted to do and if it would be ok. So thank you again for the encouragement and confirmation.

    I have learned alot from reading on this blog even while just researching the Nigerians before starting the switch over to them.  Because of this thread I started to copper bolus my larger goats and have seen improvement in their condition.  Improvement that I had not noticed they needed.  They always looked nice and healthy to me.  But I did always have a few with baldy tail tips or rusty in the flank.  And those were the ones that needed worming more often than any of the others.  But over all they looked great.  When I started with goats for the first three years I used Purina Goat Chow.....Then for the last ten years I fed them all All Grain, as I believed that I didnt know what they were putting into the pelleted part of the Purina Goat Chow and I was drinking the milk so used All Grain as it was all grain.  That way I knew exactly what the goats were eating.   They always all had good minerals free choice and the does had alfalfa pellets and such.  But now looking back over the years of doing that I can see and remember some things that indicated low copper.  So also because of reading here, recently switched everyone back over to the Purina.  Because of the copper content and started to copper bolus.  I have retained two of my Lamanchas, my best milkers from all those years of breeding and hard work that were my favorites.   It was a tough decisions to finally do the switch.   But I kept two of my old stock, first to keep me in milk till I raise these new ones up and get them breeding and giving milk.  and secondly as a back up plan to start a herd over if I didn't like the ND's.  But I can see already that I am going to stick with the Nigerians.  They are so much easier to handle.  My pastures will not get as stressed and actually will need mowing probably.  I trimmed my adult new little bucks hooves the other day and wow.  I didn't get all knocked around.  And my feed bill is going to be so much lower.  Which is a blessing for us.  As we have a very large family and money is tight sometimes and as grain and hay and all thing farm related are just climbing higher and higher in price around here.  

    Thank you again for your reply and help.  And for sharing your experience with so many people.  It really is so helpful. 

    blessings to all,

    susan

  • I always say that if you ask ten breeders what they feed their goats, you will get ten different answers! Your feeding protocol sounds a lot like mine, and we're doing fine here. I've never had a case of UC, and I've had bucks and wethers as old as seven years. The wethers only got pasture or grass hay, but I'd give bucks some grain from December to March during most winters because they couldn't keep a decent body condition in our cold Illinois winters without the extra calories. This winter, however, they just got alfalfa hay because I couldn't find any grass hay, and they didn't need the grain because it never got that cold -- and they're on the heavy side now!

    If I had to feed the way that people are advising you -- medicated feeds all the time -- I'd sell my goats. I agree with your philosophy, and I've found that as long as they're getting fresh mama's milk, the incidence of coccidia is very low. It pretty much only happens here with weaned bucks. I don't wean does or wethers until they're sold. If you were able to keep coccidia under control with your other goats, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to keep it under control with NDs. Sanitation seems to be the most important thing -- don't let poop build up in bedding. I've had a few la manchas and now have some mini manchas, and in my herd the NDs are actually hardier than the la manchas in my limited experience with the standard goats.

    I don't see anything wrong with what you're planning to do with your bucks.

This reply was deleted.